So this Joseph guy made this religion because i wanted to have sex with lots of women and didnt want it to be adultery and is using God in all of this. Why do they put our Bible in this when they dont even belive in the Bible. Jesus is the same today and forever. These old men shouldnt be rapping these little girls and their daughters these sick bastards should go to jail for life and not use this book of MOrMON as a excuse to do this sick twisted things to inocent little kidsssss

I think that one of the big problems here is over generalization. The person who wrote the last post with the same title implied that "Mormons are only worried about their PR and not what's happening"
How can someone make such an assumption?

I am a Father myself. And I don't condone the actions of the government in Texas, but I also don't condone child abuse in any form.

The FLDS matter should be studied on a case by case basis, storming the compound was the wrong move. But there is eveidence to suggest that child abuse was going on. And that has to stop.

In my view,There was wrong doing on both sides of the coin.

I don't know what others stand for. But this Mormon stands up for the Lord. All we're trying to say is that the Children aren't the only ones hurt here. The Lord ( and indeed religion in general) has been hurt by this. In this case Religion, and government have both been abused warring with one another and it's the children and good people who practice good things that have been hurt.

I'm standing up to say this:
None of this is right. What we need to be doing here is finding a way to help the children and live in peace with eachother. Nancy Grace making light of practices like modern day revelation which held sacred by people who are not FLDS, dosen't help the children. It just hurts more people.

Just because someone stands up for what they believe in dosen't mean they don't care about another injustice.

Yes, I can feel for the mothers and can only imagine how horrible it is to have your children taken from you. I have two small children of my own. But I also remember the story of King Solomon, and the woman who would rather give up her baby than have it cut in two. I know as grief stricken as I would be to have my children taken from me, I would rather them be taken from me for a short durration (short compared to a life span) until it could be proven either way than have them be continually abused unbeknownst to me. When a child is at risk of being molested, is it better to keep them in that enviroment for "months, even years" until you have proven they are indeed being victimized or take them out immediately? This is a case where it is better to err on the side of safety. While it may possibly traumatize the children for a short while and haunt them from being taken from their homes and family, it won't even compare to the life long trauma of being molested even once. Although having "their mother's presence under supervision" would be ideal, it doesn't seem realistic when the mothers refused to cooperate and answer authorities questions and encouraged their children to do the same.

This case is not about religous freedom. This has nothing to do with religous freedom. It has to do with possible child abuse. People have religous freedom to do more or less whatever they want as long as it doesn't involve child abuse. The charges are not for polygammy or their beliefs, it has to do with underaged children and statatory rape. Antonio Teixeira said "evidence of abuse is now being questioned by authotities" well, good, that is what the authorities are supposed to be doing and only proves that the justice system is in full swing and isn't just sitting there doing nothing either way. Progress is taking place to resolve the issue. Examining the evidence to make judgement is how the court system works. As for "Texas CPS is known for the use of drugs in deprogramming children." that is merely laughable coming from someone outside of the U.S. going off of whatever propagandist source you are refering to. If I cared enough to get into other countries courtcases I'm sure I too, could come up with some equally amusing statements on Brazil for your benefit. In reference to Waco, the only comparison to be drawn is that they are both cases of government vs. the people of a cult. Waco were charges of illegal guns and arms, and the FLDS case is child abuse. There has been no standoffs, or guns involved in this case which seems to be one of the main flaws of the Waco case.

John Claypool, What would you suggest the LDS church do? I'm just curious. We believe "in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law." So how would you suggest the LDS church intervene without disobeying the law or going against the government? I don't understand your fear tirade either. This isn't the LDS church the government is calling into question, so why are you? They are no more a part of the LDS church than a protestant is part of the catholic church. Although you could say protestants are "led down their path by church teachings at some level" of the catholic church. If something illegal was going on in a protestant sect I'm sure you wouldn't draw the comparison of it being catholic doctrines fault or say the Catholic church should make themselves responsible. Even though, they are technically a splinter group of early catholism.

Either way, this is a horrible situation that I believe the Texas authorities are handling to the best of their abilities given the resources they have. They needed to take the charges seriously and act on them immediately, they ARE serious charges. They have proven they are trying to give them fair and speedy trials simply by the number of lawyers they have obtained to represent the numerous children involved. Instead of sitting on it and only involving a few voluntary lawyers at a time drawing it out, they made sure everyone was represented at once with their own lawyers. Just the number of lawyers called into service for this case has been unpresedented. Everyone has due representation, the evidence is being examined and eventually, with cooperation, this nightmare for the children will end. Hopefully sooner rather than later, and if guilt is found, they will only be in a better place than where they started from.

I am a member of the true LDS church.

I am also a social worker and Mother of six children.

Child abuse and neglect is not excusable no matter what backgroud of religion or culture perpetrates it.

Children have a right to protection. However,
to separate mothers from children before the parents' guilt is established IS child abuse and neglect. Severe trauma results from such action which has far reaching effects even into adult hood.

My appeal is for the the children to be united with their mothers until the guilt of the parents are established which could take months, even years.

This is true compassion and justice can still be met. It is the children who are suffering here and their suffering could be lessened by their mother's presence under supervision of course.

am dismayed that because the LDSs are standing by wringing their hands crying “ It’s not our fault” while 400 innocent children are being subjected to virtual torture by an out of control government agency in Texas. God is going to ask everyone of those 13 million church members world wide , “What did you do when 400 of your brothers children were thrown into Hell on Earth”. True Mormons or not, These children were led down this path by church teachings at some level and one of the worlds richest churches and congregations will be remembered not because there was a distinction between the LDS and the Texas Splinter group but because the church stood by and let a catastrophe occur because they were afraid.

The LDS don't know if they are FLDS or RLDS. They claim they are neither, but seem to want to be both.

M DeHaas,

the phone call that prompted the raid in Eldorado may have been bogus.The only evidence of abuse is now being questioned by authotities. But of course, when people are moved by hate, no evidence is needed. They must be evil because they are different.

There are many brands of polygamists out there and we can't assume that abuse is part of their enviroment more than it is partr of monogamy. The FLDS families are being abused in their constitutional rights.

If there is abuse in the Eldorado community, it has to be investigated seriously. Not as the Texas Authorities are doing doing, harming those families as they keep 416 children - including unweaned babies - under state custody and submit them to "deprogrammers". Texas CPS is known for the use of drugs in deprogramming children.

I guess people don't remember about Waco anymore. Or they may have found good reasons to justify it.

How can you defend someone who attacks innocent children? People who corrupt their children at such an early age as not to question whether something is morally right or not? I have KNOWN a polygamist girl who came north to find work and then would return home to her polygamist family on holidays and such. She openly admitted to being molested by her father and older brother and just shrugged it off as "nothing." This is how she was raised. It just didn't phase her as it would have were it not rampant there. I understand your concern about the reference to clothing and hairstyles being superficial, but that is just how the world works, so when addressing the world it only makes sense to distinguish ourselves from FLDS on the world's terms of differenciating between normal and abnormal. We are not required to wear a uniform of any sort as seems to be the case with FLDS in one form or another.

Also, we are NOT the same as FLDS. They had the same gospel and CHOSE to leave it behind and form their own faction... I believe the word we call that is an apostate. Is it not? They are in no way LDS just as anyone else who chooses to leave the church is no longer LDS. They do not have the same religous beliefs as us, they are stuck in a changeless time with a false prophet (who marries off young girls to their cousins) and priestcraft. It's no wonder they are having problems with molesting their children and subjugating their women. Allegedly.

But I guess that's all just according to me. Who's so tired of hearing people justify any sort of brazen abuse and say these people are just a branch off of the LDS faith. Obviously you are ignorant in not having ever met one for your self to see the stark contrasts.

~Sandy, Utah

Antonio Teixeira's remarks are valid and make a good point; however, the comparison between mainstream Christians denying the Christianity of Latter Day Saints and mainstream Mormons making a distinction between our faith and this sect is not as simple as Mr. Teixeira states. The former is based on a spiritual comparison between beliefs that are, in some cases, very different. The latter (pardon the pun) is based on a specific set of behaviors that are illegal. Some mainstream Christians believe we Latter Day Saints are going to hell because of our beliefs. We are not making judgements about the eternal state of FLDS members. We are only fighting the misconception that there is a connection (other than historical) between our faith and that of a splinter group. This is like a disagreement between Catholics and Protestants. Protestants, for example, do not generally believe in the intervention of saints, and Catholics do. But most Protestants do not deny that Catholics are Christians and vice versa. A sect that describes itself as Baptist makes a habit of hate-filled protesting at funerals. I suspect that there are a lot of mainstream Christians - Baptists included - who would question that behavior as un-Christian.

We are not denying that FLDS members are part of our church to consign them to hell, but rather to differentiate their practices from those of our faith. Mr. Teixeira is correct to remind us that we must be careful not to sit in judgement of this group on a spiritual basis, but it is not intolerant to remind an often uninformed public that we are not the FLDS church, and that we do not practice or approve of the kinds of behaviors they do.

Texas has taken a courageous, well planned, and expensive step forward in controling this illegal lifestyle. As a Utah resident and active member of the LDS Church, I sincerely hope Utah will do the same, and that the First Presidency of the Church will use their considerable political influence to facilitate the eradication of this evil.

As a member of the LDS faith I feel almost shocked that most members in my church are so concerned about making a distinction between ourselves and polygamists that they forget the unfair treatment FLDS families are receiving from Texas authorities. The recent speech by Elder Cook mentioning unsual hairstyle and living in compounds would sound silly if it weren't a mock of the FLDS for the same reasons "the world" does. Where is religious tolerance here?

Saying that polygamists are not "real Mormons" reminds me of certain Christians who say that Mormons aren't Christans. It is the same kind of bias.

I appreciate seeing something positive regarding the LDS church. I hope people will take the time to compare the beliefs of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints with that of the FLDS. People who take this time will find more differences than similaries. Thank you for producing this video.

You're efforts to distinguish the fundamentalists from members of the Mormon Church are very helpful. Thank you. May I reiterate that Mormons don't practice polygamy, nor do they wear pioneer-style clothing. Women are not subjugated, nor are men considered superior. We love and respect our neighbors and don't seek isolation from them. More of us live outside the USA and speak other languages than English. The acronym LDS is not helpful in identifying members of the Church who are of other nationalities. Anyone calling themselves Mormon will respect the laws of the land, live moral and honorable lives, and be productive citizens.
Thank you once again.

Are Mormons Christian or a Cult?

I would first break that question up into two questions. Are Mormons Christian? If the term "Christian" here is defined as a traditional orthodox Christian, then the answer would be no. Mormon do have a slightly different view on the nature of the Godhead and do not believe the God the Father and Jesus Christ are the very same being, but actually believe them to be two different beings united in the same will which is to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of all who will accept and follow Christ. Mormons do believe that Jesus Christ is the way, the light, and the truth and that no man (or woman) can come unto God but by and through Jesus Christ. Mormons believe that Jesus Christ is the only savior and redeemer for the world, and that He is resurrected and glorified.

According to dictionary.com, one definition given for "Christian" is: "of, pertaining to, believing in, or belonging to the religion based on the teachings of Jesus Christ". By this definition, the answer to the above question is a distinct YES, the LDS/Mormon faith is deeply Christian in that all of it's theology and teachings and beliefs have their roots in Jesus Christ.

Next question....Are Mormons a cult?

The answer to this could be a yes and a no. Yes, if using the following definition from dictionary.com, "a group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc". Mormons are bound together by a veneration of Jesus Christ, his teachings, and the pattern he established for organizing his church and kingdom upon the earth. By that same definition, all so called Christians could be labeled as a cult for also having a veneration of Jesus Christ.

If another definition of cult is used, such as :"a religion or sect considered to be false, unorthodox, or extremist, with members often living outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader." Then the answer is yes and no. Yes in that Mormons are unorthodox with many of their doctrines when compared to the traditional Christianity that exists in the world today that has evolved from various interpretations and philosophies of men. And yes, you could say Mormons are lead by a charismatic leader in that they believe in and look to a living prophet for leadership after the pattern God established for leading his people both before and during Christ's mortal ministry. On the other hand, Mormons live and work very much as a part of conventional society and are not extremists in that they don't lead people to suicide or to blockade themselves from conventional society. And to label them false would be of opinion since there is no more evidence to prove the Mormon faith to be false any more than there is to try and prove any other faith false.

Then there is the question whether or not Mormons or polytheistic.

Mormons do believe in a plurality of gods, but to Mormons, there is but one God they must answer to, and again, that is God the Father, the father of Jesus Christ and the same father of all mankind residing on this earth. Again, they believe that no man or woman can come into the presence of God without sanctification through Jesus Christ.

There support the idea that there was a plurality of godly beings involved in the creation, one can look at Genesis Chapter 1, verse 26 "And God said, Let US make man in our image,..." The keyword here being, "us". Either God the Father is one being who had Jesus Christ and even other godly beings helping in the creation, or God has to be labeled a schizophrenic.

Mormons also believe that through Jesus Christ, they can literally inherit all the Father has and can literally at some point after this life, become perfect even as the Father is just as Christ taught people to be in the New Testament times. They can be heirs of God, heirs of His power, His glory, His knowledge, and all that He has and become glorified gods themselves with the power to go out in the expanses of space and create worlds of their own and people them, and thus God will be more glorified in his eternal posterity in much the same way (but on a much bigger scale) that a father in this life will not only find joy in his own children, but in their children's children, and their children's children. Being a grandfather and great-grandfather does not take power away from one, but elevates one. Mormons believe God wants people to be like him and to inherit all that he has because it will elevate him in glory and majesty, thus, by this belief, many will label Mormons as being polytheistic because they do believe that there can be an existence of many gods. But again, it must be emphasized Mormons believe that there is but ONE Father who is the ONLY God to which we must answer to at the time of judgment.

The reason that wstm.com didn't provide links "both sides" is because what you call the "other side" is blatantly bigoted, like you appear to be, and seeks only to defame and distort, without regards to any objectivity. When you want to find out what a religion believes, speak to it's adherents, not to its most bitter and hateful enemies, who twist and distort, and pull all kinds of deceitful tactics to try to demonize a good, upright, law-abiding faith practiced by millions of good folks worldwide. Also, the purpose of the article is to distinguish the mainstread LDS faith from that of another group which is obviously not law-abiding. And people like you and other anti-Mormons will try to blur the distinction, because it serves their purpose to try to defame and distort in order to tear down the Mormon faith.

I can believe that the recent liberation of hundreds of children and women from a fanatical sect of the Mormon church should not reflect on the established Mormon church, but I was very surprised that a News organization would provide only one link to one side of the story. That is sloppy and disingenuous. What is the other side? Are Mormons Christians or are they members of a cult. Are they polygamists or polytheists?

Signed,

Born and Bred in Marion before turning from Taxes to Texas